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06-01-2011, 02:03 PM   #1
Terriernut
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Dumbest question yet

I lay myself bare in my ignorance. I have googled, I have watched in awe at the amount of info here, and folks, you ARE amazing! But here goes:

I had a Hartmanns's Proceedure. That means they took my sigmoid colon bit out, tied up my wee poor anus, and stuck 'Stan' out to poo in a bag.

Now, everyone tells me I have an Ileostomy at the hospital. But...if most of my lower colon is intact and its all going thru there, isnt it a Colostomy? And if its a Colostomy, how come its always liquid and I cant be like gorgeous Cindy (aka Nyx) and have normal ploppy (ish) poo's??? It's on the left my Stan.

And is my liquid poo mean they will never reverse? (if they did, it would be the same as before 25+ a day/night in the loo?) And maybe is my HUGE parastomal hernia causing problems in the poo area? My GI has gone and had a child and wont be around for MONTHS, so, no one to ask really.

I apologize for my ignorance and hope someone can answer me.
Misty
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Misty
DX Crohns Feb 2011, symtoms 1997, 2009 and then WHAM! Emergency surgery for perforated sigmoid, fistula through fallopian tube, septic and near dead: Colostomy-Stan was born 22/12/10. Another parastomal hernia, his name is Ollie and he is MONSTER size!
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06-01-2011, 04:28 PM   #2
Nyx
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Just basing it on stoma location, it sounds like a colostomy as you have most of your colon intact...unless they formed Stan out of your small intestine. Are you supposed to have a reversal? Maybe they wanted your colon to rest and heal before the next procedure. But if it's permanent, and on the left, that to me is a colostomy (mine's on the left). But, at the same time, I believe I heard you talking about the size of your stoma, and it's quite small, isn't it? Colostomies are big (up to 70mm...mine clocks in at 45mm). Ileostomies are very small comparatively speaking. With the size and your output being runny, I'd say it's a ileostomy, even with the placement of Stan.

Not sure this helped at all....lol...Might have muddied the waters more for you...lol
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Cindy

Crohn's Diagnosis: May 2006
Current meds: none
Surgeries: Colostomy, December 2009

"Never trust a fart." Jack Nicholson, The Bucket List

Oscar is awesome! Loving my life with my stoma (with a hint of poo)!!

06-01-2011, 04:45 PM   #3
DustyKat
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Hey Misty,

Hartmann's procedure may be done with a colostomy or ileostomy and by the sound of the faecal matter that is being passed it is an ileostomy.

Did the doc say to you it was going to be reversed? It would make sense for it to be reversed if they only did it in the first place because you were too inflamed to have the bowel ends sewn together.

Dusty. xxx
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06-01-2011, 05:55 PM   #4
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I am not sure what surgical procedure I had the second time but I have an Ileostomy and mine is on the left side.

As far as surgery goes, I had a small part of the Ileum, all of the ascending colon and most of the transversal colon removed. All the rest is intact and supposed to heal and provide me, or better the surgeon, with the opportunity to reverse the process. Why he put it on the left side, I have no clue and guess it was just the best thing to do to close me up fast again because my body cavity was "poisened" by the output floating around in there.

My poo is mostly fluid and burning like crazy when hitting the skin. This, from my understanding, comes from the fact that Ileo output is full of enzymes that irritates the skin.

Just thought I contribute to the muddiness ....

Oh, and I never knew about the stoma sizes but was always wondering about that. Thanks for clarifying that for me.

And, more mystery on my end: If a reversal is planned would they really sow up your anus? (See, Misty, now I beat you with the dumbest question asked!!)
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Dec 2010: colostomy/resection - failed
Jan 2011: Ileostomy
Resection planned for: sometime
06-01-2011, 07:05 PM   #5
izzi'smom
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Your large intestine is generally larger in diameter than your small...wonder if that has to do with the size of the stoma?
I did a procedure on a woman with a stoma that had a blind pouch...so they did sew her up, although they left her a bit
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06-01-2011, 08:28 PM   #6
Nyx
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Yes, they differ in size because the large intestine is bigger than the small intestine
06-02-2011, 12:11 AM   #7
Terriernut
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Thank ya'll. My Stan is 32mm to 35mm. When born he was 45-48mm.

When googling Hartmann's Proceedure it shows that the large bowel is in full use! But my Stan doesnt look or perform (!) like a colstomy!


Misty
06-02-2011, 01:34 AM   #8
Terriernut
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I forgot to add they want to do a colonscopy on me soon as well. If I'm awake enough on the table I'll ask what the hell is going on with my proceedure.

I was inflamed when the proceedure was done. Sigmoid perforated. The head surgeon wanted to take it all out, but luckily she was off for xmas break at the time! So a Hartmann's was performed instead. At the time they did it, they said it was reversable. But 3 months later when I saw one of the surgeons he said they rarely reversed Hartmann's, and also because I had Crohn's Colitis it wouldnt be a good idea. Easy for him to say, he doesnt have two peni's!

Stan is on the left.

Misty
06-02-2011, 04:08 AM   #9
Misty-Eyed
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Hi Misty..

Can you ask for letters from your consultant to your gp be sent to you to? I seriously find out the most about my crohn's through those letters.

If not, you're entitled to have access to your notes. I'd have a great big look through them yourself as then it should be down there in black and white as to what they did. You could even ask your gp for a copy of the letter the hospital sent to them after your op to see what they did etc.
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'You can't change the past but you can ruin the present by worrying about the future.'

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Panproctocolectomy and terminal end ileostomy October 2011.
06-02-2011, 07:10 AM   #10
Welsh-bird
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Gosh, this has murkied the waters for me now!
I always assumed that an Ileo was made of small bowel and on the right (like mine) and a colostomy was large bowel and to the left. So you can have Ileo's to the left too??

I would do what Misty says, but also contact you're IBD or Stoma nurses- they know what they did and why. I thought you were being 'reversed' at some point down the line- and if not, why didn't they just do the 'full monty' in the first place?

Get on the phone to the L&D honey- they love you there!!

xxx
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Diagnosed UC 1999, Re Dx'd CD April 2011, Gastritis Dec 2010.
Resection Jan 2011, Total Colectomy 18.03.2011
Hoping to get a break sometime soon......
06-02-2011, 08:09 AM   #11
Misty-Eyed
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lol in my experience, the L&D don't know what a phone is, Andrea! hahahah :/
06-02-2011, 09:12 AM   #12
acg101
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Hey Misty,

By the description of the liquidy faecal matter that is being passed, it sounds like it is an ileostomy Hartmann's procedure (which can be performed with both a colostomy or ileostomy).

As far as the reversal, I am sure your doctor will advise you when things get less inflamed for at least 3 months.
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-Best wishes - Dan

1. Diagnosed with Crohn's UC 1995
2. Flagyl/Cipro Imuran in 80%remission 1997 2005
3. Used 5mp, asacol, 6mp, remicade, imuran, Cimzia, entocourt, Flagyl/Cipro and enemas/suppositories until 2010 with periodic relief.
4. July 9th 2010 total ProctoCollectomy surgery! Free at Last!
06-02-2011, 12:21 PM   #13
Terriernut
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Hey Misty,

By the description of the liquidy faecal matter that is being passed, it sounds like it is an ileostomy Hartmann's procedure (which can be performed with both a colostomy or ileostomy).

As far as the reversal, I am sure your doctor will advise you when things get less inflamed for at least 3 months.
The surgeons said 1 year, which would put me right back in at xmas. I dont mind missing xmas again. It certainly saves me alot of money! (I can also avoid family members I dont like...BONUS!!! Theres a bright side to everything!)
Yeah, I didnt know they did ileostomy Hartmanns!??

And yes, I will harass the stoma nurse for my notes, she's the only one likely to get them for me. (Andrea knows why...apparently I'm 'infamous' at the L&D...hmmmph)
Misty
06-02-2011, 01:28 PM   #14
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At least 1 year seems more of a realistic approach. They told me that by the time I am used to the bag, it will be time to take it off. HA -- liars!!
06-03-2011, 02:38 PM   #15
Terriernut
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I could get used to the bag if I had my figure back minus the basketball / football sized hernia.

But I am sincerely disappointed in the fact that Johnny Depp will not like me anymore. Dating again, certainly outta the question. Here I was saving myself...sigh. Never mind JD, anyone at all FFS!

Oh well, I'm alive, which I wouldnt be. So if they cant ever reverse me, I will be around to continue to cause havoc and mayhem wherever this little albino pigmy may travel! And since I can still cure constipation being the 'poo fairy' I guess my life isnt wasted! (do NOT laugh, I REALLY am called the poo fairy, I cure people of constipation ALL THE TIME, perhaps a hundred years from now, I will be a saint!!!???)

Misty
06-03-2011, 06:00 PM   #16
Misty-Eyed
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Hey Misty!! Like a said to Nyx in that other thread, it's not all about the looks!!! I'm pretty sure you've won over the hearts of the majority of us on here, and all we really have to go on in regards to your looks is your avatar.. which is a dog (a very nice dog, mind you!) But you get what I'm saying, I hope!

But yes, it must be very frustrating. But who knows, Johnny Depp may even find your bag a turn on. He isn't your average kind of guy anyway :P Don't count your chickens yet. After all, it's not your fault that Bedfordshire is lacking in decent men! hehe

Get on the phone to the L&D and find out what the hell is going on though! Sounds like you need to know for piece of mind! xx
06-04-2011, 10:07 AM   #17
LOSTnut
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Hey Misty!! Like a said to Nyx in that other thread, it's not all about the looks!!! I'm pretty sure you've won over the hearts of the majority of us on here, and all we really have to go on in regards to your looks is your avatar.. which is a dog (a very nice dog, mind you!) But you get what I'm saying, I hope!

But yes, it must be very frustrating. But who knows, Johnny Depp may even find your bag a turn on. He isn't your average kind of guy anyway :P Don't count your chickens yet. After all, it's not your fault that Bedfordshire is lacking in decent men! hehe

Get on the phone to the L&D and find out what the hell is going on though! Sounds like you need to know for piece of mind! xx
Wonderful reply -- wish I would have said it first!
06-04-2011, 12:05 PM   #18
Terriernut
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Ya'll have gone and made me cry!
Thanks!
Misty
06-05-2011, 06:14 PM   #19
ameslouise
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Yeah! What Misty-Eyed said!! Ditto!!!
06-07-2011, 02:30 PM   #20
Terriernut
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Ames...did ya know you're GORGEOUS??

Anyway, I was just chatting to Heike. And the thought hit me. If the surgeon wants to do a colonoscopy on me, she would have to go thru Stan. I dont care, because Stan has had his nerves cut, so it wont hurt. Specially since I'll be out like a light and dreaming of Johnny Depp anyway. But.....How can they get to my colon in the first place? Well they bloody well cant thats what!? And that was the head surgeon at the L&D talking mind you. My colon is on holiday in Florida. Apparently unavailable for comment, due to being drunk and perhaps on acid with Jimmy Buffett on the beach. In other words...they cant get to my colon if I've got an Ileo...

well F'ing DUH and thats a head surgeon????????????????????????

Can someone illuminate me or is my logic gone? (no wise cracks, I may be a nut, but I'm still logical in my own way!)
Misty
06-07-2011, 02:47 PM   #21
LOSTnut
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Now why would you let a head surgeon mess with your butt???
06-07-2011, 02:53 PM   #22
Terriernut
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Now why would you let a head surgeon mess with your butt???
I dont think that surgeon will be messing with my butt, which is closed up top, or anything else anymore!!! (butt only closed at top where sigmoid had been removed...not permanently closed...I'd asked for a perky barby butt...however they said I may need my saggy one back some day so they declined)
Misty
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