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Crohn's Disease Forum » General IBD Discussion » This is how I'm going to put my Crohn's into remission


 
06-26-2012, 08:44 AM   #61
Jane
 
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Acemagic -

I LOVE your hypothesis about three types of foods for Chron's disease: 1) those that cause the disease, but don't feel bad when you eat them (e.g., pasta) 2) those that irritate you when you eat them while flaring (vegetables, fruit) and 3) those that are safe.

I agree with your hypothesis and often think along these parameters when I try to decide what to eat.

I greatly appreciate this thread. This is the type of discussion I would like to have with friends but can't.
06-26-2012, 09:34 AM   #62
David
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I don't think diet actually helps that much unless you are completely in remission and then use the diet to stay in remission. A diet will not knock you into remission if you aren't already. I think diets are overrated as a "cure", I think herbs are underrated since many are potent cytokine inhibitors and many are able to kill macrophages.
There is study after study showing the efficacy of enteral nutrition. It has the same remission induction rates as prednisone when stuck with. And enteral nutrition is a form of diet. A form of diet that doesn't (directly) kill bacteria or inhibit TNFa and yet it works.

Diet works. Not for everyone, but it can most definitely work.
06-26-2012, 10:02 AM   #63
Susan2
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I've been in remission for 13 years after severe Crohn's for 35 years or so, numerous resections and associated operations and, finally, a proctocolectomy and ileostomy. I have been on no medication since the proctocolectomy.

I am fine with lamb, rabbit, turkey, occasional beef but not pork or chicken; most fish, but not shellfish (except scallops) or crustaceans. Not soy in any form.

I eat limited white bread, usually sourdough and organic, white spelt if I can get it and oats for breakfast (as porridge - I can't cope with uncooked oats). No roughage grains.

Potatoes, sweet potatoes, only leeks (well cooked) in the onion family, no chillies but well-cooked red capsicum, celariac, fennel, eggplant and various other vegetables - all cooked.

I can't cope with pulses at all. (I spend hours picking through green beans to get tiny ones with the seeds undeveloped.)

Milk and almost all milk products have always been lifesavers with me. There are a few cheeses, like blue cheese, that I can't cope with.

Few fruits - bananas (one a day), apples, if I peel and grate them or chew very thoroughly, stewed plums, watermelon, pureed and sieved berries in small quantities and that's about it.

Sorry that this has been so long, but I find it hard to categorise my positive foods except that - and this is the bit that will bring out the extreme reactions - I follow an adapted (because of avoiding roughage and irritants) Blood Type diet for B+. Before anyone leaps up and shouts "Nonsense", "voodoo" or the like, just remember that I have been in remission for 13 years on no medication.
06-26-2012, 10:43 AM   #64
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There is study after study showing the efficacy of enteral nutrition. It has the same remission induction rates as prednisone when stuck with. And enteral nutrition is a form of diet. A form of diet that doesn't (directly) kill bacteria or inhibit TNFa and yet it works.

Diet works. Not for everyone, but it can most definitely work.
I've seen the study and it showed what you said, think it was you who linked it.

My gripe with diets is this:

*many times I have seen people say, I do diet X, even though diet X has nothing to do with crohn, was not tested for crohn and no one is able to say why it works, they just do it, because it's a "good diet"

*my assumption is that crohn is a bacterial infection (it's one of the main theories right now) and those bacteria are incredibly nasty, it would be akin to someone saying that they can cure tuberculosis with a diet, everyone would tell that person they are out of their mind

*many people who say diet X works are on meds, how can you possibly know it's the diet if you're taking meds

*many people are losing weight on diets because many are excluding fats, sugar and protein, the consequence is rapid weight loss

*SCD diet is a diet many biologists wonder about because it's low on short chain fatty acids, you need those to repair tissue, so how does it make sense to recommend something like that for crohn. On the other hand recommending lower carbs like the SCD does does make sense, but lower SCFA does not, which the SCD diet does.

Those issues bother me when ppl say "diet works", yeah, maybe it does, but I still need to see the first person, not on meds, who is in a flare, who stopped the flare through a diet. Sure diet might work for long term therapy for someone in remission, but for someone in flare who is already not eating much, and they then go on a diet, that's a good way to make your disease far worse, they will lose weight and I bet they will end up being worse than better. Diet when in remission, why not.
06-26-2012, 10:56 AM   #65
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I've seen the study and it showed what you said, think it was you who linked it.
Studies. There are a lot of studies that corroborate that enteral nutrition is efficacious.

*many times I have seen people say, I do diet X, even though diet X has nothing to do with crohn, was not tested for crohn and no one is able to say why it works, they just do it, because it's a "good diet"
I'd be concerned as well. If we're going to try to help control our diseases with diet, it needs to come from well-researched information and tracking what you can consume so that you can change the diet to fit your own needs as you get data.

my assumption is that crohn is a bacterial infection (it's one of the main theories right now) and those bacteria are incredibly nasty, it would be akin to someone saying that they can cure tuberculosis with a diet, everyone would tell that person they are out of their mind
I was going to say, "Nobody is claiming to cure their Crohn's though" and then looked at the thread title I don't believe diet is going to cure Crohn's, but I believe it can lead to remission. Or even better, diet along with other treatments can lead to remission and help you stay there.

many people who say diet X works are on meds, how can you possibly know it's the diet if you're taking meds
How can they possibly know that their meds are working when their diet is potentially the cause for the remission

many people are losing weight on diets because many are excluding fats, sugar and protein, the consequence is rapid weight loss
I agree that it is vitally important to make sure that all nutritional needs are being met with any diet.

SCD diet is a diet many biologists wonder about because it's low on short chain fatty acids, you need those to repair tissue, so how does it make sense to recommend something like that for crohn. On the other hand recommending lower carbs like the SCD does does make sense, but lower SCFA does not, which the SCD diet does.
What we know is we don't know everything. Who knows why the SCD works for some people but if it does, it does. Heck, they don't even understand why prednisone works and it is an OLD medication. But if something works, it works. A doctor friend of mine has a great saying, "It works in practice but not in theory".

Those issues bother me when ppl say "diet works", yeah, maybe it does, but I still need to see the first person, not on meds, who is in a flare, who stopped the flare through a diet. Sure diet might work for long term therapy for someone in remission, but for someone in flare who is already not eating much, and they then go on a diet, that's a good way to make your disease far worse, they will lose weight and I bet they will end up being worse than better. Diet when in remission, why not.
Give this book a read. I think the data found in it might give you a new perspective.
06-26-2012, 11:11 AM   #66
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There is study after study showing the efficacy of enteral nutrition. It has the same remission induction rates as prednisone when stuck with. And enteral nutrition is a form of diet. A form of diet that doesn't (directly) kill bacteria or inhibit TNFa and yet it works.

Diet works. Not for everyone, but it can most definitely work.
Thanks for this. I'm new to this, but it is what I strongly suspect. I have to look at the fact that when this started two years ago, I suddenly had erosion in the esophagus and colon and two ulcers. This after no problems at all (not even a stomach ache or diarrhea or gas or acid) in my entire life except when I had the rare flu that everyone else had with the same symptoms. Onset was immediate when I suddenly moved to a country where starch dominates the foods eaten and that was the one ingredient that I never liked, it never tasted right and it made me gain weight like crazy. So there was always something not working right there and moving to a place where it was in everything caused my body to react within two months. (When your right side pops out to the point where you can't wear your clothes within two months, that's pretty extreme.) I know it wasn't H-pylori or the C bug because they tested for it in biopsies along with everything else. I might have been in Latin America but they tested me for everything from end to end. They explained everything to me. The GI told me to stop eating starch.

Two years later the erosion in my esophagus and my two ulcers are gone. And before you say that wasn't Crohn's, we don't know that because Crohn's can be all the way through even in the mouth, it's just not common. It also isn't common to have it show up in someone who is 52 with no diarrhea, cramps or blood. So right now it's possible but can't be verified.

Yes, my GI had me on Omeprazole, but that does not cure erosion or ulcers so the only thing left is diet.

I did a few simple things:
  • Cut starch (because that was my trigger)
  • Ate organic yogurt because it has the good stuff and no added starch
  • Took probiotics and digestive enzymes
  • Ate only lean chicken and fish (cooked in olive oil with no seasoning), spring mix (or other colorful lettuce with only olive oil, no vinegar), colorful veggies and a variety of very, very ripe fruits
  • Cut acidic juices (goodbye cranberry and pomengranate juice) and only ate the fruit
  • Took starchless vitamins
  • Drank Aloe juice with chunks of aloe in it

Nobody told me to do all of this. I did it because it made sense to me. Your gut is all about balance and somehow (probably because Naproxen ate holes in me) my body got out of balance. It perceived starch (which I ate when I took Naproxen) as the enemy and began to attack (inflammation). The rest was probably just a cascading effect of one problem leading to another. So it made sense to me to A) get rid of the trigger, since starch is the most useless food ever anyway and easy to replace for nutrients and fiber; B) take enzymes, probiotics and vitamins to get my body back in balance; and C) take something internally cooling to get the inflammation down.

I did about 400 hours of research on the chemical composition of starchy food and how the body breaks it down and what can go wrong with it (that's how I came to understand Amylase and how it breaks down starch into sugar so you can digest it). I had my brother, who is a researcher, pull all of the research we normal people can't see to find out what else they know. Then I made a decision and took a shot. When I told my GI in Costa Rica he was fine with it. When I told my GI here what I did, she was fine with it. I didn't go crazy, I just used deduction and common sense.

Diet is not a one size fits all treatment or cure. You really need to understand food and your own body in depth. My diet would not work for the majority of you because you problems and symptoms are different. You need to understand how it all works together. If you aren't willing to do the research and you can't be committed to the resulting diet (enough to leave a $50 meal sitting on a table while everyone else eats around you because it's dangerous to you) then you aren't going to be able to have success. Diet change is an intense commitment that requires a lot of work. It's hard to do under the best of circumstances and most of us are already so sick and in so much pain that it's hard to think straight let alone read hundreds of hours of research and stick to a diet that is very hard when our lives are already hell.

At the end of the day, each of us must make our own choice and take responsibility for the consequences. When my GI comes to me with suggested treatment, I'll be responsible to know everything about those drug options, their efficacy and side effects and make the best choice I can. I'm the only one who will live (or not) with the consequences so it's up to me. I'm not going to judge anyone on this board because we're all just doing the best we can to feel better and survive. But I will say approach everything with an open mind because science discovers things all the time that discount or change previous theories. If we aren't open to at least looking at those, we only hurt ourselves in the end.
06-26-2012, 11:17 AM   #67
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ZM, based upon what you're saying, you may want to get this book or research the Specific Carbohydrate Diet. It may connect some dots for you and give you other ideas. The paleo diet discussed in this thread will also likely be interesting for you to learn about.
06-26-2012, 12:47 PM   #68
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Interesting. SCD's premise seems exactly like mine and follows exactly what I think happened to me right down to the increase in waste:
  1. When the body receives complex carbohydrates (disaccharides or polysaccharides), these substances must be broken down before they can be absorbed.
  2. In the body of a person who is not able to break these substances down efficiently, an influx of undigested material causes harmful bacteria to flourish.
  3. Bacterial overgrowth is accordingly followed by a significant increase in the waste and other irritants they produce.
  4. Irritation in the lining of the digestive tract results in the overproduction of mucus and injury to the digestive tract, which in turn causes malabsorption and makes it even more difficult to maintain proper digestion.

I do believe I looked at it this way of eating at one point, but I will take another look at it. Paleo has to be scaled way back for me because alot of things it allows, I can't eat. SCD is probably closer to what I can do.

Oddly enough, milk doesn't bother me at all and never has. I count my lucky stars there because when I travel it's all I can have on the plane. Having nothing for 20 hours is tough.

Thanks for this!
06-26-2012, 01:20 PM   #69
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Interesting. SCD's premise seems exactly like mine and follows exactly what I think happened to me right down to the increase in waste:
  1. When the body receives complex carbohydrates (disaccharides or polysaccharides), these substances must be broken down before they can be absorbed.
  2. In the body of a person who is not able to break these substances down efficiently, an influx of undigested material causes harmful bacteria to flourish.
  3. Bacterial overgrowth is accordingly followed by a significant increase in the waste and other irritants they produce.
  4. Irritation in the lining of the digestive tract results in the overproduction of mucus and injury to the digestive tract, which in turn causes malabsorption and makes it even more difficult to maintain proper digestion.
See, some stuff she says in the book makes sense, but here the issues I have with the book beging, what is she writing about, mucous collitis or crohn, or does she believe it's one and the same. She never mentions inflammation through excess tnf-alpha production, she thinks it's mucus overproduction. So what is it...if it's mucus overproduction then how come lowering TNF is stopping inflammation. I mean the stuff she says makes sense, but she says a lot of stuff that has nothing to do with crohn specifically, she uses that theory for multiple diseases.

I think the SCD diet might help, if someone changes it to work for crohn specifically with good research behind it, and the issue of SCFA is solved.


what she says:

"a significant increase in the waste and other irritants they produce"




what actually happens in cows with johne's:

"mucosal tissue damage results primarily from severe immune pathology and chronic inflammation.In the late stage of the disease, large numbers of acid-fast bacilli (AFB) are found in lesions (3, 6)."


what she says makes sense, but I don't think it's that powerful, diet that is, unless you are in remission, and the excess TNF is resolved, then maybe to stay in remission, but I don't think going from flare to remission with a diet is possible.

Last edited by kiny; 06-26-2012 at 01:42 PM.
06-26-2012, 01:46 PM   #70
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Another thing is, let's say someone wants to claim that going from a flare into remission is possible with a diet. How come, that there are so many people who stop eating altogether don't go into remission at all.

If it was that simple that you only needed to avoid X and Y, and avoid waste and slow digesting carbs (that's her theory, she has no issues with fast digesting carbs like honey) like the SCD diet, then how come everyon who stops eating, and many do with crohn, get sicker and the inflammation doesn't go away.

The inflammation and excess TNF are NOT going to go away by changing to a diet, it would take years to starve a bacteria, and even then, they can see bacteria can survive in very harsh conditions, they adapt, deplete them in iron and sugar and they simply adapt and survive. Once you are in remission I believe in it, but a diet that knocks you from a flare straight into remission, I do not believe that, the inflammation will stay for those people and they will just lose weight.
06-26-2012, 02:21 PM   #71
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Another thing is, let's say someone wants to claim that going from a flare into remission is possible with a diet. How come, that there are so many people who stop eating altogether don't go into remission at all.
Remember your theory (I think it's a theory of yours at least) that Crohn's Disease is an immunodeficiency? I agree with that. I think that vitamin, mineral, and other nutrients play a vital role in disease pathogenesis. Stop consuming any forms of nutrients and the available nutrients become further or completely depleted and the cycle continues.

Inflammation can go away with enteral nutrition. It can even promote mucosal healing.

And I think you're focusing on TNFa a little too much. Yes, some of these medications are marketed as TNFa blockers but why then did Enbrel do worse than placebo in trials and it's a TNFa blocker?

Now, I absolutely believe that your bacteria play a role. But ponder the idea that the bacteria might be taking up more than their fair share of various vitamins and minerals and other nutrients OR not producing them or synthesizing them like they usually do and what might result. The result can have cascading affects, and those affects would be different in various phenotypes. Throw enteral nutrition into the fray and the body gets all its nutrients and the bacteria get their nutrients and everyone is happy. Go on the SCD and don't provide food to a specific type of bacteria that out-compete bacteria that synthesize vitamin B2 which is causing iron deficiency anemia which is causing which is causing which is causing (so many cascading affects)... and once they're no longer an overgrowth and you're getting vitamin B2 again, then homeostasis returns. This is just one of a million potential reasons why diet can help or hinder.
06-26-2012, 02:59 PM   #72
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I think everyone has to do a lot of research for themselves. Some things she says are legal, I could never eat because they do contain starch that is an amylose starch. Some of those foods are low starch, not no starch. Some she says are illegal are fine with my body which couldn't care less about milk but that would probably do most of you in. I don't believe any diet, including the diets given by Crohn's specialists, are one size fits all. I could never be on the diet that most of you have been given. It would put me in the hospital in three days.

Also, inflammation is a symptom of a problem that is not just different for the different diseases, but different in the different people within those diseases. If that wasn't true everyone could be on the same medication for the same length of time to get it under control. So that is why some people won't respond to diet alone. I don't believe that inflammation can't go away in anyone with diet alone any more than I believe that inflammation will go away for everyone with diet alone. What I do believe is everyone is different and there are no cookie cutter solutions.

I also believe that the drugs used now are treating symptoms and not the underlying cause and that not a lot is known about those drugs or how they work. If you read about those drugs, none of them purport to be effective for everyone with Crohn's. Lowering TNF works in some but not in others and some go into remission for years and others don't. It's the same thing. This is a disease in its research infancy. In 20 years it is very possible they won't use TNF inhibitors at all. It's very possible that they will be in the exact same place as researchers are with migraines where they keep realizing that they thought they knew the ultimate causal factor but in fact they were only treating a symptom. Once they treat the symptom successfully, they find out there is something behind that and something behind that and so on. This is the case with most research for illnesses or abnormal functions.

I'm more of the opinion of this is what we know right now. Nothing has been proven beyond a shadow of a doubt. It is imperfect and not the end of the story. All we as sufferers can do is find out as much as we can, talk to our doctors as much as we can and make the best decisions for ourselves based on as much as we can.
06-26-2012, 03:13 PM   #73
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The result can have cascading affects, and those affects would be different in various phenotypes.

This is something my GI pointed out when I first saw her and one of the reasons I like her. She gave me a list of tests she was going to do and said more were coming. Then, she told me that one problem can lead to another and another in a cascading effect. She said that she needed to uncover all of the problems, assess them and then determine in what order she needed to treat them and what she needed to use. She said this was important because if she did not treat them in the correct order with the correct things, she could end up causing other problems. She told me that if I had multiple problems, it was all about the balancing act but that we would figure it out and come up with a plan. It sounded very logical to me.
06-26-2012, 03:25 PM   #74
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I love that your GI sat down with you and explained something like that If she is on the gulf coast, PM me as I need a new GI
06-26-2012, 05:18 PM   #75
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Wow, there's a lot of good discussion here. First and foremost:


I was going to say, "Nobody is claiming to cure their Crohn's though" and then looked at the thread title I don't believe diet is going to cure Crohn's, but I believe it can lead to remission. Or even better, diet along with other treatments can lead to remission and help you stay there.
Yeah I'm sorry about that. I actually re-thought about that about a week ago. It really should have read "This is how I'm going to put my Crohn's into remission"

To be honest, I don't know for sure if diet is going to make a lick of difference. As you mentioned, everyone is different, and there are no real solutions available. But most of us are also grasping at straws and the general consensus is that diet seems to matter. I just don't personally feel that we should sit back idly and assume that just because it hasn't been proven that diet plays a factor in treatment of the disease, that we shouldn't try to take a look at the broken evidence that does exist and take our best shot at it. As someone mentioned earlier, there's no money in that, so no one is going to do the research. If I come to you and ask you for 5 million dollars to conduct a study on diet, but if it doesn't pan out you're going to lose your 5 million, but if it DOES pan out, you'll help a lot of people, but you're still going to lose 5 million dollars....well...there's not a lot of people who would jump on that opportunity.

From what I've read, SCD has had a good deal of success, but doesn't work for everyone. Paleo seems to have a slightly better rate of success (again, just from what i've read). Does it work 100% of the time? Absolutely not. Do we know why it works? Nope. But there are thousands of people on this diet and the testimonials I have been reading (from Hugh and Beach and others on this forum and other forums) lead me to believe that my best bet for healing is to remove a lot of the junk in my diet.

Also, regarding meds, I'm just not a big fan. I've been med free for years, but I've also had a poor diet. I've tried almost every medication available to us and have always felt that the side effects were worse than the disease. Plus, many of the meds offered to us have long-term side effects (like "Can Cause Cancer") and with our already increased risk at developing bowel cancer, I'm not too interested to go on them. So yes, maybe it's really dumb, but I've been down that road. I ignored diet for 14 years and took all my meds like a good boy. It got me 3 resections within 14 years and my gall bladder and appendix out. I'm a results oriented person, and I wasn't getting the results I wanted. Cause and effect.

As someone mentioned...we know very little about the disease, but everyone wants to get better. Based on the information available to us and from everything I've read and people I've talked to and my personal experiences, this is the path I'm going on (diet and supplements, herbs etc). If it bombs, so be it. Next surgery, I'll try something else, but for the time being, it's my best odds at achieving REMISSION

-Adam
06-26-2012, 05:20 PM   #76
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I think what you're trying is wonderful Adam

Would you like me to edit the thread title for you?
06-26-2012, 05:24 PM   #77
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this link sums it up for me........
http://www.swaraj.org/shikshantar/swimology.htm.
less talk, more healing

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Last edited by hugh; 06-26-2012 at 05:45 PM.
06-26-2012, 09:39 PM   #78
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I think what you're trying is wonderful Adam

Would you like me to edit the thread title for you?
Haha,

Naw thats alright. Thanks David! If we change it now, it'll probably just confuse people who have been following it.

-Adam
06-29-2012, 01:04 PM   #79
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Hey everyone,

Day 19 on Paleo.

I haven't gained anymore weight unfortunately, I'm still sitting at 124. I saw my Naturopath yesterday (who seems to be very good) and when I mentioned I was on paleo, she wholehartedly agreed that it's a very good place to be, regardless if you have Crohn's or not.

She said that my gut is still probably leaky and potentially inflamed / still healing from surgery, so the first step is to heal the gut so it can absorb nutrients better, and the weight gain will come after that. So I'm taking L-Glutamine for the leaky gut and strong probiotics. I was tested for Candida before my surgery and there was a slightly higher than normal amount, so we're going to try a mild cleanse in a week's time. She's also been treating me with NAET (which I think is totally hokey and crazy, but I'm willing to try everything and she says she's had good success with it).

Energy levels seem to be a bit down today, and the cramps that I get before a BM are pretty intense. I'm thinking I may have jumped onto "nuts" too quickly. I feel like I'm pooping razor blades. Other than that and occasional copious amounts of gas, I'm pain free. No cramping every few minutes. I think I can safely attribute that to the surgery, however, not necessarily the diet.

I'll be trying out the new juicer tonight too! It arrived yesterday!

-Adam
06-29-2012, 02:31 PM   #80
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I love this forum! And my friends on it! Love how we can discuss and debate, all of it for our own health's sake. And just when my brain goes into overload, in comes Hugh to make me laugh out loud. Thanks everyone!
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Previous meds: Sulfadiazine, Flagyl, Prednisone, Imuran, Pentasa, Asacol
Surgeries: re-section 2004
Currently taking: B-12 injections every 2 weeks, multi vitamin/mineral, fish oil (1000 mg), D3 (5000 mg)

Also lucky enough to have psoriasis as well.
06-29-2012, 06:13 PM   #81
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Hey everyone,

Day 19 on Paleo.
I'm thinking I may have jumped onto "nuts" too quickly. I feel like I'm pooping razor blades.

-Adam
I'd stay away from nuts for a while longer, they can irritate,
In a while try nut flour as you get to trial nuts without the abrasiveness of chewed up nuts, also soaking in water overnight might help but you don't need them on paleo
(i'll try to post some paleo nut muffin recipes soon)

I'd be interested in which 'version' of paleo you are flowing (low fat,high fat etc).
A good resource......
Paleo Principles – Blog Posts You Should Read
http://www.paleoplan.com/resources/p...u-should-read/

This might be of interest
Paleo Diet Myths http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UmmUlgckXF4
- i'd still avoid nightshades (because of glycoalcaloids?)

Last edited by hugh; 06-29-2012 at 06:41 PM.
06-29-2012, 07:54 PM   #82
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Hugh - You've really been a help to those of us who are trying to Paleo-ize our diets. thanks for all the links. I've read so many different Paleo bloggers - some say yes this, no that; others say no this, yes that. Then I found this link (through one of your links):

http://chriskresser.com/beyond-paleo...paleo-template

I like the idea of making it a template. Especially with Crohn's, everyone has their individual triggers and tolerances, so I liked having more generalized guidelines than a list of "do" and "don't" eat.

I've been working on keeping to a Paleo-style diet for a little more than 10 days, and overall have so much more energy. I was primarily vegetarian before, and I didn't realize how much damage I was doing with raw veg and whole grains (which my brain said were good) and no protein (which I have found my gut really likes). I think the glutamine in the protein is helping me. My GI doc even said "you look good" yesterday...but he wasn't so happy to hear that I wasn't taking the meds he tried me on. When I started trying to talk to him about how I thought my diet changes were helping, he literally stood up and started walking toward the door (!). Well, he's referring me to another Dr now. Guess I am too radical!
06-29-2012, 08:04 PM   #83
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Just to clarify a point- Quinoa is not a grain. It is actually a seed but it's appearance is grain like. Quinoa has more Omega 3 than Flax. Also, the problem with grains is the processing. Look at wheat in the field and then at bleached flour. I personally do my best to stay away from grains but if you must eat them, go for the least processed ones.

Adam, I think you are on the right track. Make sure you get enough healthy oils. Ease into ab exercises! Go slow with those. Learned my lesson on that one. Stress relief is essential. I tell people that diet, stress relief, and exercise are the 3 keys to staying in remission.

Good luck and good health!
Wendy
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06-29-2012, 08:32 PM   #84
ZM1019
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Ack Quinoa. Talk about feeling like you ate razor blades!

Sorry. I know most people can eat it but someone talked me into that once I had three days of pain so bad I couldn't sleep or concentrate. I won't even eat food that has been prepared any where around that because it gets into everything. Bad memories.
06-29-2012, 08:43 PM   #85
hugh
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Quinoa contains saponins, which can damage the gut lining

@LaLaNapa - yup , i'm heading towards Archivore and Perfect Health diet, almost identical but arrived at from different thinking, I call it paleo based
06-29-2012, 08:54 PM   #86
Beach
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Glad I'm not the only one that has trouble with nuts! It isn't particularly paleo, but I ate some spicy cashews the other day, seemed like a tasty treat at the time, but last night and this morning .... lets just say I'll be laying off nuts, cashews in particular, for a good long awhile. That wasn't any fun. And once that was over I got to workout at the gym! It was a leg day, which has the pleasant effect of hitting the stomach muscles also. I'm exhausted.

I can remember the days where I would anxiously check to see where my weight was. Any movement upwards was exciting. And I would wear as many cloths as possible, along with keys, shoes and occasionally a jacket. Anything to make myself heavier! I'm glad the paleo or primal diet helped me to put on some weight and muscle. I'm hoping the same happens for you.

No fun about the sharp pains when using the toilet. Along with the operation, I recall earlier in the thread a mention about normal bowel movements after taking a new drug. If that is the case, maybe a stool softener will be helpful. If I might suggest, the mineral magnesium has anti inflammatory effects, and softens stools. Possibly it could be helpful. Drinking water high in magnesium I guess would even be considered paleo. When our ancestors obtained drinking water from stream, it was higher in minerals, magnesium in particular. Along those lines, recall this article:

"Magnesium and you-Part I"

http://blog.trackyourplaque.com/2009...ou-part-i.html

snippet from the article:

If this were 10,000 B.C., you’d get your drinking water from streams, rivers, and lakes, all rich in mineral content. Humans became reliant on obtaining a considerable proportion of daily mineral needs from natural water sources.

21st century: We obtain drinking water from a spigot or plastic bottle. Pesticides and other chemicals seep into the water supply. Municipal water purification facilities have intensified water purification in most communities to remove contaminants like lead, pesticide residues, and nitrates. (For a really neat listing of the water quality of various cities, the University of Cincinnati makes this data available.)

But intensive water treatment also removes minerals like calcium and magnesium.

Many people have added water filters or purifiers to their homes,, like reverse osmosis and distillation, that are efficient at extracting any remaining minerals, converting “hard” into “soft” water. In fact, manufacturers of such devices boast of their power to yield pure water free of any “contaminant,” minerals like magnesium included. The magnesium content of water after passing through most commercial filters is zero.

Modern enthusiasm for bottled water has compounded the problem. Americans consumed a lot of bottled water, nearly 8 billion gallons last year. In the U.S., nearly all bottled water has little or no magnesium.

The result is that we can no longer rely on drinking water to provide magnesium. The Recommended Daily Allowance (RDA)—the amount required to prevent severe deficiency—for magnesium is 420 mg per day for men, 320 mg/day for women....
06-29-2012, 09:19 PM   #87
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Location: Calgary, AB, Canada
I'd stay away from nuts for a while longer, they can irritate,
In a while try nut flour as you get to trial nuts without the abrasiveness of chewed up nuts, also soaking in water overnight might help but you don't need them on paleo
(i'll try to post some paleo nut muffin recipes soon)

I'd be interested in which 'version' of paleo you are flowing (low fat,high fat etc).
A good resource......
Paleo Principles – Blog Posts You Should Read
http://www.paleoplan.com/resources/p...u-should-read/

This might be of interest
Paleo Diet Myths http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UmmUlgckXF4
- i'd still avoid nightshades (because of glycoalcaloids?)
Hugh,

As LaLanapa said, THANK YOU very much for your helpful posts. They're always great.

Matter of fact, thanks to EVERYONE who is helping me along (Beach, ZM, David & Kiny just to name a few!). This is exactly what I was hoping for.

In answer to your question, I'm not following a particular version that I'm aware of. I'm just sticking to fruits, veggies, nuts (but i'll try and reduce these based on your advice) and meats. No dairy, no grains, no refined sugar.

That being said, I rarely have the time to cook, so my Paleo is based on a lot of eating out. Lots of Vietnamese food (meat and veggies -- no noodles), eggs and bacon for breakfast, and some fruit, and for dinner, I'll usually BBQ a steak or chicken and steam some asparagus or broccoli. If I'm eating out for dinner, I'll usually eat at Nando's Chicken.

There's probably a "cheat" in there (the coleslaw has a mayo style sauce, but very minimal, and I eat the occasional Larabar -- not one with peanuts) and I occasionally have a glass of Moscato wine. Overall though, my diet is significantly better than the fried foods, potatoes and noodles diet I was on before. Matter of fact, its VASTLY different. I think I'm on the right track at the very least, even if I can't go forage for things myself

-Adam
06-29-2012, 09:20 PM   #88
acemagic
 
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I was primarily vegetarian before, and I didn't realize how much damage I was doing with raw veg and whole grains (which my brain said were good) and no protein (which I have found my gut really likes).
Hey LaLanapa,

What harm did raw veggies do to you? Can you elaborate a bit?

-Adam
06-29-2012, 09:27 PM   #89
acemagic
 
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Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Calgary, AB, Canada

I can remember the days where I would anxiously check to see where my weight was. Any movement upwards was exciting. And I would wear as many cloths as possible, along with keys, shoes and occasionally a jacket. Anything to make myself heavier! I'm glad the paleo or primal diet helped me to put on some weight and muscle. I'm hoping the same happens for you.

No fun about the sharp pains when using the toilet. Along with the operation, I recall earlier in the thread a mention about normal bowel movements after taking a new drug. If that is the case, maybe a stool softener will be helpful. If I might suggest, the mineral magnesium has anti inflammatory effects, and softens stools. Possibly it could be helpful. Drinking water high in magnesium I guess would even be considered paleo. When our ancestors obtained drinking water from stream, it was higher in minerals, magnesium in particular. Along those lines, recall this article:
Hey Beach,

Haha I can totally relate. I used to weigh myself with all my clothes on and tons of stuff in my pockets too....until my MOTHER found out and guilt tripped me into doing otherwise. Now I have to make sure I weigh myself in the morning with nothing but my boxers on so I can ensure I'm the most depressed possible

The drug you're referring to is Cholestyramine. It's actually a stool BULKER. Without drugs, I end up going to the bathroom 12+ times a day, and it's always loose/watery. So the doc recommended this as a way to reduce that effect. But it might be working a little too well. Luckily, it's in powder form and the doc told me to experiment with it until I find a happy medium. I'm going to try and reduce the nuts in my diet and see how things are pain-wise. After I determine that, I'll play around with the Cholestyramine a bit more.

And in reference to magnesium, yup! I take 2 Calc/Mags every morning Along with Vitamin D!

-Adam
06-29-2012, 09:46 PM   #90
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Well, nearly every time I ate a salad or Subway Veggie sandwich (both my former faves) it would feel like a weedwacker was going through my gut. In my rationalization I thought, "well at least it's healthy food doing that, not cookies and donuts". But I've been doing a lot more research and have found that especially during a flare it's best to have the veggies cooked to break them down a bit before ingesting, so I've been sticking to that. I recall the the SCD diet started that way too, even pureeing the carrots in soup and not eating them cooked.
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