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Crohn's Disease Forum » Diet, Fitness, and Supplements » Juicing » Juicing as a Viable Treatment option!


 
11-29-2012, 12:15 PM   #121
mink
 
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HI Gianni,

I hope you are still winning on the health front, you so deserve to as it seems to me you have made great sacrifices in your life to win the your health fight, financially (juicer but well worth it ) and food wise, being vegan and avoiding grains and other foods affecting Candida. That is a very tough lifestyle to follow 24/365. Yet you just do it. Through your posts I am convinced juicing is the best option for Crohn's and the difficult changes you have made in your diet are vital to sustaining the relief you have gained. Thank you for making me understand this. The phyto estrogen effect was temporary when I got my diet more balanced (not eating kale every day).

As my symptoms have subsided, out of respect for you Gianni, and all the other users of this site, especially considering the sensitive and emotive function of this site, i do not deserve freedom of speech in this forum unless and until I am diagnosed with Crohn's.

Gianni, I deeply appreciate your uplifting and attentive posts sharing your insights and wisdom which you have gained in the hardest possible way, and sharing it with me and others to comfort us and revealing your amazing stance that needs to be adopted to get through the reality of each day in the face of Crohn's.

Gianni I will never forget you and will continue to acknowledge you and others in my prayers, thanking God for the upbuilding support i received from your posts and from reading other's experiences.

I hope you dont mind Gianni, only the following spring to my mind concerning you :

Proverbs 17:17 "A true companion is loving all the time, and is a brother that is born for when there is distress".

Provberbs: 19:17 "He that is showing favor to the lowly one is lending to Jehovah, and his treatment He will repay to him".

Psalm 41: 1 and 3 "Happy is anyone acting with consideration toward the lowly one; in the day of calamity Jehovah will provide escape for him. Jehovah himself will sustain him upon a divan of illness; all his bed you will certainly change during his sickness" (refreshing one by various means just as you have done for me and others).

Also i love this, as it shows God hears our prayers:
Psalm 145:16 "The desire of those fearing him he will perform, And their cry for help he will hear, and he will save them".

Thank you. Mink
12-19-2012, 10:25 PM   #122
crohnsmother
 
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Just read your post. Do you eat between juicing, or is that your main diet? My daughter, 13 yrs has cd so it is not all optional but I encourage her to drink smoothies. After your article, thinking to get a juicer. Doc said today since she has a stricture, her growth is being stunted so may need surgery. Do you have a suggestion for a juice that also helps weight gain?
Thanks for your post! Will I be alerted of your answer-not yet familiar with this system
12-20-2012, 04:12 AM   #123
Gianni
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Hi Crohnsmother,

I do eat between juicing. I am vegan and eat solid foods but just will include juicing into my daily regimen. I do sometimes do juice fasts where I will only drink juice and water for an allotted time... a couple days, 1 week, 2 weeks etc etc.

No juices are really going to directly help your daughter gain weight although I believe that including nutrient dense juices may help allow your daughter to be more receptive to holding onto the good proteins, fats etc. I believe restructuring her diet would be the first move to do here.

You can make a new thread in the Your Story (click that link) forum and post your daughters story so other members can better help you and your daughter.

Also if you wouldn't mind I would love to hear the specifics of your daughter's current diet. You can post it in the Diet Fitness and Supplements Forum and I will give it a look

Yes you will be notified when anyone replies on a thread that you yourself have replied to. It will show up in your "My Forum" section on the front page.

Hope this helped

Gianni
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01-08-2013, 02:45 AM   #124
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Gianni, thank you so much for this. This is exactly what I have been looking for. Off to find a juicer......
01-09-2013, 12:58 PM   #125
Ya noy
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Unfortunately I do not. I really want to get a dehydrator but they are rather expensive. I would love to get one soon and then write about those benefits as well, so maybe in the future sometime. I know there are a few people on this forum who use dehydrators so you might want to reach out to them. Using the search engine by typing in dehydrator should yield some results. Sorry I couldn't be of more help as I'm not entirely comfortable claiming health benefits from dehydrators yet.

I'm glad you enjoyed the post.

Gianni
I paid all of $1.50 for mine. Rummage sales. You live in L.A.? Shouldn't be difficult. Just get up at 6am on any Saturday morning and go for a bike ride. It's how I got my bike too, and it's an extremely high-end titanium road bike that normally would run around $6K new. (I'm not paranoid either, everyone really does want to steal my bike!) Craigslist is good too.

Also how I got all my canning jars and equipment, fermenting crock pots, and oh, just about any and everything imaginable.
01-09-2013, 03:50 PM   #126
Jennifer
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Hey Gianni I've got a quick question about juicing. Probably a stupid and easily answered one but I have to ask.

Why do people have to juice like 10 or so carrots when normally they'd probably only eat one for a snack or a couple in a meal? Where's the science behind X juiced carrots = 1 carrot? Is there science behind it or is more added just to reduce hunger?

Why can't we juice what we would normally eat? Sure it'd be like a shot glass of juice but it would contain the nutrition we're looking for rather than possible overkill which may cause diarrhea and chew up all your cash.

Let's say I juice my veggies that I'd normally eat for one meal and have my protein or whatever else I eat on the side since I wont be juicing that and just do it that way. Will I not be getting enough nutrients? I'm aware that some nutrients are left in the pulp that was removed from the juicer and even the best juicers out there don't remove all the nutrients or moisture so one may need to add an extra carrot or two but why 5,000? I would never eat that much of one thing in one sitting unless I wanted diarrhea, which I don't. :P

I think juicing would have more of a chance with me anyway if I didn't have to buy as many veggies (would be more cost effective, all you really need to do is buy the juicer and just juice what you would have ate + maybe a little extra) and would reduce the possibility of diarrhea since you wouldn't take anymore in than you'd normally consume.

Guess this was more than one question but in the bold is the most important part and that question doesn't apply to just carrots but for all things juiced. There has to be some science behind it somewhere.

People don't normally consume so many different veggies at one time. They eat what's available around them even if we go way back to hunter gatherers. In stores we have access to foods which would never normally grow around us so I don't see the need for juicing everything in the store into one glass unless you're doing something specific for a vitamin deficiency. Feel free to school me in this department.

David if you know the answer then feel free to jump in. I know you blend rather than juice. Do you add extra food than you'd normally consume or do you just blend up what you would have had with your meal?

Keep in mind I'm looking at juicing as a way to consume vegetables without having to deal with the fiber they come with rather than having to cook them down to make them easier to digest. I would continue to consume other things I can tolerate such as meats and some grain products. Edit: And would also continue with 3 meals a day along with possible snacks.
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Diagnosis: Crohn's in 1991 at age 9
Surgeries: 1 Small Bowel Resection in 1999; Central IV in 1991-92
Meds for CD: 6MP 50mg
Things I take: Tenormin 25mg (PVCs and Tachycardia), Junel, Tylenol 3, Omeprazole 20mg 2/day, Klonopin 1mg 2/day (anxiety), Restoril 15mg (insomnia), Claritin 20mg
Currently in: REMISSION Thought it was a flare but it's just scar tissue from my resection. Dealing with a stricture. Remission from my resection, 17 years and counting.
01-09-2013, 04:48 PM   #127
Gianni
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Why do people have to juice like 10 or so carrots when normally they'd probably only eat one for a snack or a couple in a meal? Where's the science behind X juiced carrots = 1 carrot? Is there science behind it or is more added just to reduce hunger?
Well the reason why I personally like including or suggesting a bunch of vegetables into the recipes is because I don't believe "normally" is enough vegetables. I believe most people today aren't eating nearly enough vegetables as we should be consuming. I don't really ever juice just one vegetable like 10 carrots. Rather I incorporate a wide variety of different vegetables. It is an amount that we wouldn't even think about having on our dinner plates but it is something you can almost bet that we had in our more primal times. We didn't have grains, packaged foods, always readily available meats, to keep us full and at the same time our ancestors expended energy much more rapidly than we do on a daily basis. A staple of the our primal ways was foraging. Anthropologists believe the women foraged while the men hunted. While not all environments yielded the best results for foraging, most did and I'm sure we capitalized on that. Also I realize that they probably didn't have access to winter kale and ginger, and garlic etc etc. But what they did have access to was more raw plants that really aren't grown commercially any longer. And that is the beauty of so many of the vegetables and fruits. Although many look, taste, and appear different they all contain many of the same baseline vitamins, minerals, and enzymes. Take carrots for example. According to researchers they weren't cultivated as food until 5,000 or so years ago yet we find such great benefits in them. They aren't just made to give us great benefits, rather the human genome will evolve to create these benefits. So a likely explanation is that our human ancestry had been in contact with high levels of the same antioxidants, vitamins, and minerals that are within a carrot.

Think of it this way. I could have made this post about the importance of eating A whopping salad for lunch everyday. And then between dinner and lunch 2 carrots and then dinner include many many more vegetables but that isn't realistic and I'm not sure many people would be comfortable making 70% of their diet vegetables.

I don't believe an all vegetarian diet is a smart decision in the longrun but I do believe that vegetables are the medicine of nature and hold great healing properties and that is why I went vegan for a year... not because I believe it is the best diet for humans, but because I believe it is the best diet for a sick body. So by just including what you normally would eat and just juicing it is basically just juicing to avoid the fiber which is something I wouldn't suggest. You would actually be cutting down on your vitamin intake and you would be spending $100 on a juicer that wouldn't be utilized properly.

From another angle:

I believe that most diseases today are caused by the weakening of the immune system whether it be through environmental toxins, or diet. Many people in this world are sick so I would assume they aren't really getting adequate nutrition ( just showing you my thought process)

So by just juicing what one sick person "normally" eats, I don't think will benefit that person much if at all.

From another angle:

Looking at just raw vitamin and mineral levels found in today's average celery they are vastly different than a truly organic celery. So our ancestors are eating truly organic celery grown from nutrient dense and rich soil thus they are getting more vitamins and minerals therefore today we need to supplement even more to reach those levels.

Why can't we juice what we would normally eat? Sure it'd be like a shot glass of juice but it would contain the nutrition we're looking for rather than possible overkill which may cause diarrhea and chew up all your cash.
I simply believe people need to eat more vegetables than they normally eat. Have you tried juicing? Did it cause you diarrhea? Usually we can figure out why the juice is causing those issues.



I don't really want people to look at juicing as just a way to remove fiber. While I do juice because I believe that we need to include more vegetables and juicing does that, I do believe fiber is extremely important for digestive health. I like the gut rest Idea for juice fasts and for severe cases but after I juice I often have a big salad with lots of fiber

Juicing with other meals and snacks and what not is perfectly fine but again I think it's a way for people to include more vegetables to the levels I truly think we do need.

Anyways I hope that answers your question... it may not have.



Gianni
01-09-2013, 10:40 PM   #128
Jennifer
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I simply believe people need to eat more vegetables than they normally eat.
That's your answer. I was hoping for numbers but I added some towards the end of this post.

Think of it this way. I could have made this post about the importance of eating A whopping salad for lunch everyday. And then between dinner and lunch 2 carrots and then dinner include many many more vegetables but that isn't realistic and I'm not sure many people would be comfortable making 70% of their diet vegetables.
I don't see what's wrong with that. In the long run it sounds cheaper then juicing and not just because you don't have to buy a juicer. Sadly that's a diet many of us on here can't follow unfortunately. I'd be comfortable making 70% of my diet in the form of fruits and vegetables.

I don't believe an all vegetarian diet is a smart decision in the longrun
Why not? Studies have been done on vegetarians and how they live longer. Here's just a quick link:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/kathy-...b_1981838.html That one even mentions them being healthier.

So by just including what you normally would eat and just juicing it is basically just juicing to avoid the fiber which is something I wouldn't suggest. You would actually be cutting down on your vitamin intake and you would be spending $100 on a juicer that wouldn't be utilized properly.
There's a lot I don't understand here. Let's say more vegetables are included and are enough to make you full for a meal. Is that still cutting down on your vitamin intake? How much? What does it matter how someone uses their juicer? That's irrelevant. Why is juicing to avoid fiber a bad thing? Lots of people can't handle a high fiber diet, including myself. If I were to eat a lot of raw vegetables, organic or not, I'd get diarrhea from it. If I were to juice them instead to avoid the fiber and didn't get diarrhea, wouldn't that be a good thing? You're not absorbing much of anything with diarrhea.

toxins
I don't understand this word. It could mean a lot of things. I know you put environmental in front of it but that still doesn't explain what it means. Reminds me of the phrase, "remove toxins from the body." I don't understand what any of these "toxins" are.

Have you tried juicing? Did it cause you diarrhea?
Not yet but we've talked about how I haven't and why already therefore I've never gotten diarrhea from it. I'm not against trying it and never have been. Any raw fruits or vegetables give me diarrhea if that matters.

Usually we can figure out why the juice is causing those issues.
How? Besides eliminating through trial and error.

I don't really want people to look at juicing as just a way to remove fiber. While I do juice because I believe that we need to include more vegetables and juicing does that, I do believe fiber is extremely important for digestive health. I like the gut rest Idea for juice fasts and for severe cases but after I juice I often have a big salad with lots of fiber
So we just add a little fiber to our diets every now and then when needed.

I think it's a way for people to include more vegetables to the levels I truly think we do need.
What levels are those? At some point people will need numbers and scientific backing. So I grabbed some real quick.

This is for "mental well-being" so says the study. "Seven 80-gram servings of fruits and vegetables every day." http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/1...n_1952516.html I'm sure we could find one for what we need physically as well (I'm getting internet overload right now so maybe someone else would like to chime in for that portion).

So how much is 80 grams then? Depends on the fruit or vegetable. You could weigh them if you want or there are some guides online which will tell you how much is in an 80 gram serving for X fruit/vegetable. Here's one: http://www.best-salads.com/p/vegetab...ortion-80.html

I'm no scientist but the serving sizes I'm seeing don't match the juicing recipes at all. A lot more is included in the juicing recipes. Was just trying to figure out why its necessary but apparently it isn't.
01-10-2013, 12:26 AM   #129
hugh
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"I'm no scientist but the serving sizes I'm seeing don't match the juicing recipes at all. A lot more is included in the juicing recipes. Was just trying to figure out why its necessary but apparently it isn't. "

If you are interested in serving sizes then maybe Terry Whals can help
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KLjgBLwH3Wc

It's worth watching the whole thing but at 8:50 she starts on serving sizes Her interest is Multiple Sclerosis but portion sizes would be the same. (although you might need to adjust quantities for vegetarianism).

Everybody is different and some get alot out of their food, some less so there is no set 'serving size'.
Juicing is a way of taking large quantities of nutrients, way more than the 'required amount'

"Studies have been done on vegetarians and how they live longer."
I'm always sceptical, firstly, almost any diet is better than the SAD

secondly, these studies are almost always bogus.
the china study is bullshit
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01-10-2013, 12:49 AM   #130
Jennifer
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Juicing is a way of taking large quantities of nutrients, way more than the 'required amount'
There's a lot to be concerned about if you're taking in too many nutrients so serving sizes are very important.

"...too much vitamin C or zinc could cause nausea, diarrhea, and stomach cramps. Too much selenium could lead to problems including hair loss, gastrointestinal upset, fatigue, and mild nerve damage."

"When it comes to vitamins and minerals, more is not necessarily better."
http://www.webmd.com/food-recipes/fe...-many-vitamins
01-10-2013, 03:25 AM   #131
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I don't see what's wrong with that. In the long run it sounds cheaper then juicing and not just because you don't have to buy a juicer. Sadly that's a diet many of us on here can't follow unfortunately. I'd be comfortable making 70% of my diet in the form of fruits and vegetables.
Oh nothing is wrong with that, not at all. If you can do a real 70% fruit and vegetable diet then all the power to you but that is a difficult task. If you think about the grains, oils, starches, meats that are in your average day, it becomes a daunting task. It certainly is easier for people to rather just supplement juices.

Why not? Studies have been done on vegetarians and how they live longer. Here's just a quick link:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/kathy-...b_1981838.html That one even mentions them being healthier.
Yes, I read all these studies too but you must realize that vegetarian and vegans are generally more health conscious in every aspect of life. Typically it is these vegans that are juicing and that are doing yoga and that are eating organic and that are growing their own food. There is no doubt to me that a vegan and vegetarian diet can be extremely beneficial when it comes to health but I for one also believe it can be dangerous in the LONG term. When you become vegetarian you are disregarding a huge portion of our evolutionary diet. While you may be able to supplement many of the meat nutrients, it is hard to say if you are truly getting them all. Food science is very juvenile right now. There is simply not much out there. Researchers estimate there are as many as 10,000 food chemicals not yet discovered... that being Vitamin A is a food chemical, Vitamin C is a food chemical, so on and so on. By ignoring the big elephant in the room you may be doing your body harm. Ignorance is bliss but not when it comes to your diet and your health.

And yes these vegans are living longer... but longer than the average.. the average being what hugh just covered: The SAD diet.

There's a lot I don't understand here. Let's say more vegetables are included and are enough to make you full for a meal. Is that still cutting down on your vitamin intake? How much?
Well you would be including more vitamins then because you would be consuming more than you would normally eat. You asked if you just juiced what you normally ate. If you juiced just one carrot (what you normally ate) instead of eating it then yes, presumably you could be losing vitamins because the pulp undoubtedly contains nutrition. This is where vitamin absorption comes in and its hard to tell for the individual but some people might not assimilate all the nutrients if the carrot is raw, while they would absorb more in liquid form although for the most part they tend to stay the same. (from what I know).

What does it matter how someone uses their juicer? That's irrelevant.
I don't think that's irrelevant. There will be differences between someone who juices only what they normally consume versus an influx of fruits and vegetables. And a difference between those who juice mostly fruits versus mostly vegetables etc etc.

Why is juicing to avoid fiber a bad thing? Lots of people can't handle a high fiber diet, including myself. If I were to eat a lot of raw vegetables, organic or not, I'd get diarrhea from it. If I were to juice them instead to avoid the fiber and didn't get diarrhea, wouldn't that be a good thing? You're not absorbing much of anything with diarrhea.
It isn't a bad thing. I just think that juicing has much more use than simply removing fiber is all. And no doubt that if that were the case then juicing will benefit you and get those vitamin levels up. I would just caution that it is important to retain fiber within the diet. While some people can't handle alot of fiber I think it is important to slowly incorporate fiber into your diet to kind of build back digestive health.

My brother couldn't handle fiber at all so I told him to get a juicer and he did. He juiced for about 6 months quite regularly. While he never did abandon fiber completely he did avoid. After about 6 months of juicing he noticed that fiber didn't bother him anymore and he was able to have salads on the regular. You see juicing can be a gateway into including fiber and it definitely can be utilized for that but I guess I simply think juicing should be viewed as so much more than just a way to avoid fiber.



I don't understand this word. It could mean a lot of things. I know you put environmental in front of it but that still doesn't explain what it means. Reminds me of the phrase, "remove toxins from the body." I don't understand what any of these "toxins" are.
Just how we don't fully understand everything that aids that human body, we don't understand everything that hurts it. But the known ones include heavy metals such as mercury, arsenic, aluminum, Lead etc. Sugar substitutes like aspartame and acesulfame K. Detergent cleaners- Benzene, Benzoic. Plastic chemicals such as BHA, BHT. Formaldehyde, Nitrites, Pesticides, Pharmaceuticals... The list goes on and on and on http://www.purezing.com/living/toxin...gredients.html


Muppet had a similar question in my other thread so I'll quote my response:
Great question, When I first started juicing I wondered the same thing.

Well first off juicing in general is an amazing "detox" because the vitamins, minerals, phytonutrients, etc are all beneficial to the major detox organs like the liver, kidneys, skin, and lungs.

The liver has the function of filtering the blood coming from the digestive tract. So we eat toxic foods then the toxins are in our blood stream momentarily but the liver will hold on to these toxins and will turn the fat soluble toxins into water soluble ones through enzymes. Fat soluble toxins pose more of a threat because well they will stay in your body for a long period of time while water soluble toxins will be filtered by the kidneys and ultimately excreted as urine. The other more concrete toxins that could not be made into water soluble are excreted through bile produced by the liver.

The liver however is very sensitive especially in the modern world today with the influx of environmental toxins. Liver's will get sluggish fast and start accumulating a surplus of toxins. So in a way you can imagine the liver as a sponge which is constantly being squeezed and pulsed, but then it gets sluggish... so the dirt water starts to build up a little more at a time (toxins) which slows down the liver even more and more and it turns into a snowball effect. Then the sponge becomes placid and it is full of dirty water. So by giving the liver an inpouring of vitamins minerals and enzymes, it will start to soak in these nutrients and get healthier and pulse a little bit and a little bit more until all the dirty water (toxins) is out and start to work normal again.

The liver when diseased, inflamed, fatty, sluggish will start to release toxins irresponsibly and the toxins will instead be stored in our fat cells which can cause longterm health complications.

Here is a more raw way to look at it:

Quote:
The liver plays several roles in detoxification: it filters the blood to remove large toxins, synthesizes and
gets rid of bile full of cholesterol and other fat-soluble toxins, and the live enzymatically eliminates unwanted
chemicals. The enzymatic process to dispose of toxins occurs in two phases: phase 1 (Oxidations) and phase 2 (Conjugation). Phase 1 neutralizes the toxin or changes the toxic chemical to form activated intermediates which
will then be neutralized by phase 2 of the enzyme system. This pathway converts a toxic chemical into a less
harmful chemical and is achieved by oxidation, reduction and hydrolysis reactions. During this process, free
radicals are produced and if there are too many it can damage the liver cells. With the help of antioxidant, it reduces
the damage caused by free radicals. One important antioxidant for neutralizing the free radicals produced in phase 1
is glutathione (GHS) is oxidized to glutathione disulfide (GSSG). This antioxidant is required for one of the key
phase 2 processes. When so many free radicals are produced from phase 1, the glutathione stops producing
oxidative stress or liver damage. The toxins are then transformed into activated intermediates; therefore the rate at
which phase 1 produces activated intermediates must be balanced by the rate at which phase 2 finishes their
processing. Phase 2 is called the conjugation pathway because the liver cells add another substance such as
cysteine, glycine, or a sulphur molecule to a toxic chemical to make it less harmful. As a result it makes the toxin
water-soluble so that it may then be excreted from the body via watery fluids such as bile or urine. There are six
phase 2 detoxification pathways:
1.Glutathione conjugation
2. Amino acid conjugation
3. Sulfation
4. Acetylation
5. Glucuronidation
These conjugation molecules join with specific enzymes to catalyze the reaction process. The liver is then able to
turn drugs, hormones, and other various toxins into substances that are secreted from the body. Read more: http://people.cornellcollege.edu/bno...liverDetox.pdf


As far as specific juices go: There are two types of Detox juices. What I mean by this is there are juices that will target the vitamins and minerals the liver in particular will need and then there are those that will try to achieve a high alkalinity and sulfur level.

Juices that target the liver will pertain to the above process I talked about


The alkalinity theory is a bit more complicated. Basically in a nut shell the theory is that these toxins hold a acidic ph level and your body will create fat to house these toxins.
(this goes along with the theory that it isn't fattening foods that is causing obesity issues but rather the influx of toxins). So the liver is sick, and the toxins are released into the bloodstream so your body holds on to more fat so that it can house the harmful toxins because it wants the toxins out of the bloodstream as soon as possible.

Now these acidic toxins are stored in fat cells so by giving your body Alkaline foods like vegetables, the acids will be neutralized and released and with them the fat cells will be too. So with that the liver becomes less fatty and healthier and the Ph level in your body will go down and neutralize many of the toxins.

The Alkaline theory is a bit more subjective and exactly that, a theory but it does make a bit more sense to me at least the fat part. Many people try to lose weight through exercise but It rarely works, in part because I think the body wants to hold on to the fat to protect you from the toxins it has encapsulated.

The sulphur aspect is more concrete and I'll let you read about it here :http://www.livestrong.com/article/317807-sulphur-detox/

Typically Juice Detox recipes will include a high alkaline through leafy greens while incorporating high sulfur produce like Onions and Garlic. Of course the leafy greens also play a double role by including very helpful vitamins to keep the detox organs healthy and happy.

How? Besides eliminating through trial and error.
Trial and error is one useful way. Eliminating fruits is a common resolution to this problem especially amongst crohnies as much of the sugars are digested in the lower small intestines ( often where people are diseased). People also don't always do well with sulphur containing vegetables. Some people also don't do well with acidic produce.

What levels are those? At some point people will need numbers and scientific backing. So I grabbed some real quick.

This is for "mental well-being" so says the study. "Seven 80-gram servings of fruits and vegetables every day." http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/1...n_1952516.html I'm sure we could find one for what we need physically as well (I'm getting internet overload right now so maybe someone else would like to chime in for that portion).

So how much is 80 grams then? Depends on the fruit or vegetable. You could weigh them if you want or there are some guides online which will tell you how much is in an 80 gram serving for X fruit/vegetable. Here's one: http://www.best-salads.com/p/vegetab...ortion-80.html

I'm no scientist but the serving sizes I'm seeing don't match the juicing recipes at all. A lot more is included in the juicing recipes. Was just trying to figure out why its necessary but apparently it isn't.
I weighed an apple in my refrigerator then converted it to grams. 142 grams for an average sized apple. I simply don't believe 4 apples a day worth of fruits and vegetables is enough. Sure that is an upgrade from the USDA's recommended daily allowances ( which I think is completely off base) but It isn't much of an upgrade.

While I realize science is what people need and the science just isn't there behind juicing. I have an excel sheet where I have labeled all the fruits and vegetables and their vitamin contents but its another thing to try and pick how much a body needs. I do try... I try and see what makes most sense but really I think it is mostly about listening to your body and not not indulge hunger on processed foods but to eat a strong vegetable diet that includes that meat and legumes and so on and so forth. I for one have noticed and now believe that that hunger feeling you get isn't because your body wants substance, it is because your body needs nutrition. People will have a huge horribly deficient meal but then be hungry a few hours later. Well if they ate a nutrient dense diet, that wouldn't have happened. I believe listening to your body is very underrated today.

Science backing juicing would be great but theres not much, if any research being done for it. But I don't think because there is a lack there of funding for research towards juicing that people should steer away. Science hasn't uncovered much to be honest so I'd hate for people to hold their breath waiting for the ok to start eating the correct amount of fruits and vegetables.

Gianni
01-10-2013, 04:31 AM   #132
Jennifer
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If you think about the grains, oils, starches, meats that are in your average day, it becomes a daunting task. It certainly is easier for people to rather just supplement juices.
I don't think so. If you go by what you purchase from the store, be it organic or not or if you go by what you grow in your own backyard, you know what you're eating and where it came from. If you make your own food, just like you have to make your own juices then it shouldn't be anymore difficult than juicing. This is off topic though and I'm not trying to derail here so we can simply agree to disagree here.

While you may be able to supplement many of the meat nutrients, it is hard to say if you are truly getting them all.
Blood work would tell if you were or not.

Researchers estimate there are as many as 10,000 food chemicals not yet discovered
Now I need sources.

And yes these vegans are living longer... but longer than the average.. the average being what hugh just covered: The SAD diet.
That's a good thing though. Average is average, proving that people can be healthier through different food choices is important to getting rid of the so called "SAD" diet (I never heard it called that before so I don't know what it stands for, but I get the idea of it well enough). So I wouldn't dismiss the studies just because you don't care for the current average. Its one of the few ways to get rid of that type of food or at least help to limit it.

While I realize science is what people need and the science just isn't there behind juicing.
That's unfortunate.

I for one have noticed and now believe that that hunger feeling you get isn't because your body wants substance, it is because your body needs nutrition. People will have a huge horribly deficient meal but then be hungry a few hours later.
People will crave specific things due to being low in them no doubt such as salt for one.

"One of saltís main benefits is to promote fluid retention in our bodies. For this reason, dehydration from sweating, diarrhea, or vomiting may increase our taste for salt." http://answers.webmd.com/answers/119...i-craving-salt

People sometimes also feel they are still hungry when its very likely they may be thirsty.

"The hypothalamus controls both hunger and thirst, so it sends the same signal whether you are hungry or thirsty... "It might be that empty feeling in your stomach only needs some water for satiety." http://www.livestrong.com/article/44...y-and-thirsty/ I don't like using that link but the only one I found from Web MD was meant for children and didn't explain it well enough. :P

Well if they ate a nutrient dense diet, that wouldn't have happened.
Any source for that?

But I don't think because there is a lack there of funding for research towards juicing that people should steer away. Science hasn't uncovered much to be honest so I'd hate for people to hold their breath waiting for the ok to start eating the correct amount of fruits and vegetables.
I don't believe anyone is arguing against juicing at all. I'm just curious and love learning so I tend to ask a lot of questions especially if I haven't done it. These questions aren't for my own benefit though but also for everyone who's been reading.
01-27-2013, 03:34 PM   #133
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To me it speaks volumes that industrialized nations have higher rates of inflammatory diseases than do nations where people eat more agrarian back-to-the-land diets. Doctors can minimize diet with Crohn's til the cow comes home, but some things come down to "the obvious." Gianni's first post on this thread holds insight.

I'll share my opinions with the caveat that they are only opinions. The pharmaceutical industry, while wonderful in many instances, is big business. Any time medicine is deemed the only therapy to treat a disease with little mention of how personal responsibility plays a role, then a huge financial benefit goes to the "purveyors of pills." Personally, I feel that many Western medicine doctors are guilty of breach of duty when they fail to even mention diet as a contributing factor in disease. Thankfully, more and more are doing the right thing. That said, I'm a believer in individuals taking personal responsibility for their health and with the Internet at our disposal and bookstores galore, there is much we can do for ourselves. I say utilize conventional Western medicine where necessary, but put 100% effort into "healing thyself" through stress reduction, exercise, sunlight, spiritual nourishment from God, and unadulterated whole foods grown in the earth.

Juicing allows the digestive system to rest while allowing boatloads of good nutrients to bless the body. Gianni's juicing approach makes good sense and I am so glad this topic is being discussed on this thread.
01-27-2013, 03:44 PM   #134
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Reading another thread on here made me wonder - "what do our nearest relatives the chimps eat?"

This site tells me they eat nearly 60% friuit and they juice !

"They chew some fruits to form little fruit-balls, called 'wadges', and then dip them in water before sucking out the juice."



http://www.wildchimps.org/wcf/english/files/chimp4.htm
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01-27-2013, 08:45 PM   #135
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I wouldn't mind reading a new thread made by either of you on the subject of genetics vs the American diet as possible causes. Would be entertaining and I might even weigh in.
I agree with this... Crohn's disease is found on both sides of my family. Genetics can't be fully discounted.
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01-27-2013, 09:27 PM   #136
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This is my take on it. While we can't ruin our genetics from a potential cause for crohns, it would then be possible that the first people who developed crohns did so because of their eating habits, and then once they have children it gets passed on, etc. It's the same as diabetes. I know there will be many people who disagree with me, but diabetes can very well be contributed to diet, just as much as it can be genetics. Think about it, (for example) your parents eat like complete shit. If you're growing up around people that eat like that, 10 chances to one you're going to eat like that as well. Boom, diabetes. Sure your genetics may make you more susceptible to diabetes, but it is because of the food that goes into your mouth, even before you're old enough to feed yourself. It is very well a lifestyle problem.

I think diet is HUGE with crohns, and I only need a few reasons to believe so. Crohn's diagnosis are on the rise, and what a coincidence so are the amount of fast food chains we see, the increasing number of additives companies are filling their products with to reduce cost and increase profit. This stuff isn't real food. I don't know when the first case of crohns was found, but I would put money on it not being anywhere near the caveman times. Why? Because they ate natural, properly grown/killed foods. This is why many diets are based off foods cavemen ate, because they didn't have crohns.

I am experiencing it myself currently after starting the SCD diet. I'm not preaching the diet by any means, but I considered myself symptom free before starting the diet. Hell was I wrong! I've felt better in the 26 days I've been on it than any medicine has ever made me feel, and I can now say I am symptom free. Look at the crap in the medicine many people take, there's so many fillers and preservatives. It's all chemicals that is not natural by any means for the body. We'll use thimerasol for example.

I once talked to an African American doctor that was working in a hospital while I was there. We got talking about crohns and he told me before he came to Canada, he had no idea what crohns was. Weird, they don't eat the crap we do, and they don't have nearly as many cases of crohns in Africa. Hmm?

Also, let's look at the number of people over 65 on the forum. I don't even think I could count 5. However, let's look at the number of young kids, or parents of young kids joining the forum. Why? because it's much faster and cheaper to eat like crap than it is to healthy.

Lastly, I'm sure I'm not the only person noticing the over representation of members from Western European countries on here. Again, weird. We have high numbers of crohns, we're also developed countries where our food companies focus on low production costs for high profits.
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01-28-2013, 07:04 PM   #137
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This is my take on it. While we can't ruin our genetics from a potential cause for crohns, it would then be possible that the first people who developed crohns did so because of their eating habits, and then once they have children it gets passed on, etc. It's the same as diabetes. I know there will be many people who disagree with me, but diabetes can very well be contributed to diet, just as much as it can be genetics. Think about it, (for example) your parents eat like complete shit. If you're growing up around people that eat like that, 10 chances to one you're going to eat like that as well. Boom, diabetes. Sure your genetics may make you more susceptible to diabetes, but it is because of the food that goes into your mouth, even before you're old enough to feed yourself. It is very well a lifestyle problem.

I think diet is HUGE with crohns, and I only need a few reasons to believe so. Crohn's diagnosis are on the rise, and what a coincidence so are the amount of fast food chains we see, the increasing number of additives companies are filling their products with to reduce cost and increase profit. This stuff isn't real food.

There's actually 2 different types of diabetes. Diabetes type 1 is genetic, while diabetes type 2 is often the result of poor diet, obesity and/or lack of sufficient physical activity, but not always.

Fast food doesn't fit my definition of real food either, but neither does most pre-processed foods as well.

All you really have to do is start reading the labels to see all the preservatives, sodium, sugar, chemical additives and high fructose corn syrup, along with the overall low vitamin content. Most of them contain very little in the way of anything remotely resembling significant nutrition value.
01-28-2013, 07:19 PM   #138
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Yeah I'm aware of the two types of diabetes but diet definitely plays a role in type 2. I didn't mean just say just fast food either, because a lot of the food you see on the shelf isn't much better.
01-29-2013, 03:04 PM   #139
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Yeah I'm aware of the two types of diabetes but diet definitely plays a role in type 2. I didn't mean just say just fast food either, because a lot of the food you see on the shelf isn't much better.
Just clarifying for anyone else reading this thread who might not realize the difference between the 2. Diabetes type 1 runs in my family, but fortunately, neither I or any of my siblings seem to have gotten the gene. Couple others in my family though actually have devices that feed insulin directly into their bodies intravenously on a continuous basis.

I totally agree that Crohn's and many other disorders are very likely caused by all the food additives and chemicals. Once you really start looking into it, it's pretty scary.
02-01-2013, 04:17 AM   #140
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Just wanted to thank everyone involved in this post. I was diagnosed back in September and was put on a low res diet. I have not eaten any fresh fruit or veggies in months and it started taking a toll on me. I never would have thought I would ever crave veggies. But last week, I just couldn't take it anymore. I am sick of being tired, having absolutely no energy, not being able to focus, etc. I knew this was because of my crap diet. I discovered juicing through a documentary... Started doing some research and it landed me on this forum. I invested in a juicer and today, I packed my shopping cart full of organic veggies. It's going to be quite a ride (I'm also fructose intolerant) but I'm just so happy I have a way to get some veggies in my diet. Celebrated tonight with a recipe called "better than a salad" (dr told me i couldnt eat salads because of strictures) and it was delicious. Can't wait till I start feeling the effects from these wonderful plants. Thank you all for the info!
02-15-2013, 01:14 AM   #141
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WOW! I started juicing just over a week ago and I feel so much better. I have way more energy than a few weeks ago. I feel that I am sharper mentally (except first thing in the morning lol). My memory is definitely better, two weeks ago I had to write everything down or I would forget. Today, I am much better.

Before I started I thought maybe after a few months I might notice something different but I never expected such a dramatic difference. This week has been crazy busy both at work and in the evening but I still feel like I have energy at the end of the day. Two weeks ago I was bagged by the time I got home from work and I wasn't nearly as busy.

Thanks you for this post!
03-01-2013, 01:48 AM   #142
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I do feel a lot better and have way more energy. Additionally I just got my blood work done and my liver enzymes, which have been mildly elevated for a long time, are now well in the normal range. Interesting. I don't have anything to back it up but I have been told that beets and carrots might be helping.

I am concerned about getting too much though so now I guess I have to figure out how much is just right.
03-09-2013, 05:32 PM   #143
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Time is a big issue for many. And it was a issue for me for a long time as-well. For when i know I am going to have a busy week what i do is on Sundays I will juice for the whole week and store the juice in jars and in the fridge. The nutrient loss will be minimal in air tight glass jars. So each day just open the fridge and grab a juice.



Gianni
So, say I would get glass mason canning Jars, and juiced everything and put them in there and sealed them up pretty good, the juice would still have plenty of nutrients throughout the week? I'm just trying to get a good understanding! I'm a stay at home mom, so I do have time to make sure I do my juicing, but sometimes we are much busier than others.
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03-09-2013, 05:35 PM   #144
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By the way, this is all incredible information. I've been really getting into the importance of plant based diets and I'm radically changing my families eating habits to a much cleaner diet. I'm hoping this helps me, I'm feeling a bit hopeless.

I've been juicing for a couple of weeks now, and so far I love it! I'm trying different things out and through trial and error have made some great juices And most of them my 2 year old loves!
03-10-2013, 04:01 PM   #145
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So, say I would get glass mason canning Jars, and juiced everything and put them in there and sealed them up pretty good, the juice would still have plenty of nutrients throughout the week? I'm just trying to get a good understanding! I'm a stay at home mom, so I do have time to make sure I do my juicing, but sometimes we are much busier than others.
That's correct. Some nutrients will be lost, but apparently it is supposed to me minimal and I still do feel amazing off juices that have been sitting a few days in the fridge. Just make sure the lid is on tight
03-10-2013, 04:33 PM   #146
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Thanks! Will do. I made a juice today that was awesome. Swiss chard, spinach, strawberry and blood orange
03-31-2013, 12:30 PM   #147
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I know this thread is a bit old, but I've been reading to catch up while recovering from surgery earlier this week, and have a couple of questions for you, Gianni.

Breakfast is typically a fresh juice, or If I don't have time, a piece of fruit like a kiwi, pear, or apple. The juice will be have more fruit in it than I would typically do because I feel like fruit in the morning can you get energized for the rest of the day. Maybe a carrot, sweet potato, orange, apple juice.

Lunch is typically a large salad that will almost always include an avocado and balsamic vinegar and olive oil.

Dinner is either another salad, or I will make a soup or I will experiment with a new recipe like a collard greens wrap, or spinach tortilla wrap. If I'm feeling real rewarding, I will have some vegan thai food.

You can look at my Juicing Recipes thread for more on what I juice.

I rarely take protein powder, although I do when I exercise a lot in a week. When I do it is hemp protein powder. Hemp is a complete protein and isn't dairy based like many of the protein out there. I believe if you are eating enough, you are getting enough protein, much like if you are breathing you are getting enough oxygen. I think society has become quite obsessed with protein.

The only vitamin I supplement is b-12 sublingual liquid vitamin. All the other vitamins I get from my food/juices.

I do take cold pressed flax seed oil supplement capsules as well to get my omega oils.
This question isn't really about juicing, but nutrition in general. I often have this problem when people give examples of their diet - I don't understand how you can survive on such low calorie food! Unless you are using huge amounts of olive oil, I don't see how it would be possible to gain enough calories. How much salad, soup and juice do you have to consume to maintain a healthy weight?

I am extremely underweight and every meal leaves me feeling incredibly full, and that's even with eating a lot of high calorie food in order to get as much energy as possible without having to eat large volumes of food. My stomach doesn't empty properly, so I know I feel full much easier than other people, but I still seem to need so many more calories than you could be getting from this diet in order to keep my weight up.

Along similar lines:

just like your housedog our body needs to use a large portion of our energy to fight off our disease and give it the best fighting shot. So by excluding the fiber from the vegetables and just drinking the juice you are essentially fasting but at the same time replenishing your body with an extreme concentrated dose of energy so that it can go into superman mode and take care of your body. This is precisely why I am a proponent of 10+day juice fasts.
There's not much energy in fruit, and even less in vegetables, so how is juice a concentrated dose of energy? Or are you referring to nutrients rather than energy?

I'm always looking for ways to get my weight up, so I'd be interested to know how you think juicing would fit into a weight-gaining diet. I do have smoothies sometimes as a way to get fruit which goes down easier than chewing through whole pieces of fruit.

Also, I just wanted to comment on KWalkers post:

Also, let's look at the number of people over 65 on the forum. I don't even think I could count 5. However, let's look at the number of young kids, or parents of young kids joining the forum. Why? because it's much faster and cheaper to eat like crap than it is to healthy.

Lastly, I'm sure I'm not the only person noticing the over representation of members from Western European countries on here. Again, weird. We have high numbers of crohns, we're also developed countries where our food companies focus on low production costs for high profits.
I think the population of this forum is probably determined as much by demographics of Internet users more generally than by the demographics of people with Crohn's. People over 65 are less likely to be posting online than young people, so if people over 65 did have Crohn's, they'd be less likely to be here than teenagers and young adults.

And since the forum is in English, it's going to primarily be people from countries where English is the first language who you'll find here. Someone from another country who doesn't speak English isn't going to post here even if they do have Crohn's, and nor is someone from places without much Internet access.

A lot of people on this forum do seem to be very interested in diet and try to eat healthily, so I'm not sure looking at the members of this forum suggests a link between poor diet and Crohn's.
04-09-2013, 02:44 PM   #148
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I'm currently doing SCD and new to this juicing forum. SCD is working perfectly for me but after reading the beginning post and the science behind juicing I've been considering giving juicing a try. I don't know much about juicing though....except how to make it. My biggest question (and I know this might have already been covered but it's a lot to read lol) is how long would I have to juice to achieve results/cure? Also, do I juice for every meal or just some meals? Thanks for any help and advice anyone can give.
04-09-2013, 03:20 PM   #149
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Personally I juice once a day (most days), mostly the red head recipe, and felt far more energetic within a week.

Good luck and I hope you experience similar results.
04-09-2013, 03:22 PM   #150
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Hello.
Talking about results - personally, I felt better as soon as I began juicing. By juicing every morning I had the energy to get through the day and I am sure it helped me cope with being anaemic.Since then I really miss it if I have a juice free day, it has become part of my life.

But to talk about cure is a bit different and I am sure Gianni would be the best to answer that.

As for how often you juice, I would think you will see the best/quickest results the more you do it. But try for at least once a day, I always have it for breakfast.

When I do a juice only diet I find it is best to have four juices a day and three days is enough to see an improvement in my digestive health.

Good luck and happy juicing.
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