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08-10-2006, 08:37 PM   #1
mikeyarmo
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Cutting out Dairy

I have decided to try to avoid dairy from my diet for now on. I was getting quite bloated when having any, and this bloating was lasting for several hours (if I had dairy at lunch I was still bloated at dinner). I decided to avoid dairy for at least the short-term and see if this helps at all.

I will keep you all posted .
08-10-2006, 11:43 PM   #2
Jeff D.
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I think that it would be a wise decision considering that milk now days is really fake. There are even preservitives in some companies milk to make it last a few more days. I can taste the chemicals in milk so I would stop drinking it if I could gain weight without drinking it. I actually feel better when I do not drink it but my mom gets mad if I don't.

Good luck on your adventure
08-12-2006, 05:32 PM   #3
mikeyarmo
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Thank you sir!


There are different types of "milk" besides that from a cow, like goats and sheeps milk (I think there is sheeps milk).

There are also milk choices that do not come from animals like soy milk and almond milk. I have had the almond milk and you can even buy it in flavours (vanilla or chocolate) so you may want to try and encourage your mom to get that for you instead.
08-12-2006, 10:35 PM   #4
Jeff D.
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Almond milk they are making milk from everything these days. You see I think the problem in our modern world is though that everything is overly processed. If things were less processed then I think we may even have the cure to Crohn's. Reason being that most people in the western world do not get Crohn's or most stomache diseases because they do not eat things that our bodies cannot produce proteins or fats from. Instead we just get artificial crap. Like with milk, if they did not feed the cows crap then there milk would be better for us. Then if they did not have mass cow farms and over milk the cows they would not need antibiotics and therefore they would not have to get rid of these particles by superheating the milk. When they do that everything they that is good about the milk goes to waste. I think if people only bought local milk it would be better for us and at least be a start to making people better. At least theoretically it should work. But people would never do that in our society because they are too lazy to actually make a second trip from the market to the milk farm.

Anyways thanks for the advice

Jeff

End of rant
08-13-2006, 05:00 AM   #5
devildee(donna2005)LOL
 
Hi

Thats a good idea but you need to take some form of calcium tablets though as we need it im on them permanently from the dietician because i dont drink milk, we are more likely to get brittle bone is what she said

good luck with it mikey (((hugs)))
08-14-2006, 09:12 AM   #6
meowsie
 
I cut out most dairy from my diet a couple of months ago and have noticed a HUGE difference. I don't have nearly the gas or any of the bloating that I had when I was doing as little as putting milk on my cereal. Dairy does a real number on our systems, unfortunately. Luckily, tho, I can get away w/ having a slice or two of american cheese with my eggs.
08-20-2006, 12:30 PM   #7
Kev
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Hey guys... Let me throw in my 2 cents... I've found (thanx to my new GI) that it's not so much the dairy, per se, as it is the lactose content... I've switched to using non lactose milk and milk products... and non lactose margarine. I'm on the same meds as before, but this time they are working... You can even get lactose free cheese... (made from vegtable products)... Any athletes/bi-athletes who've experienced severe pains/cramping/shin splints, etc., after prolonged activity have experienced a buildup of lactic acid in their muscles... And those of us with forms of IBD apparently can't properly turn lactose into lactic acid without problems... I've experienced far lower pain levels than I was last year this time, and the meds have controlled my blood loss (was typcially losing a litre of blood approx every 4 - 6 days at the worst of it last year)... Let me reiterate, I'm on the same meds as I was this time last year, but now that I've reduced/eliminated lactose from my diet, I am experiencing VERY marked improvements... It's not a 'miracle cure', but it has made a big difference in my life... I've heard that goats milk has no lactose, but I haven't tried it... I also heard (vaguely) that "THEY" (whoever 'they' are) are discovering problems inherant in the use of soy milk... I also found, and this is just a purely anecdotal piece of info, that on my trip to the DR, I had no problems with the local milk there in either coffee or tea,... either because it was heated, or it wasn't cows milk... I didn't/couldn't find out whether or not it was cows milk, but I understand that heating milk that has lactose causes enzymes to release & breakdown... I don't know enuff about it to express an opinion, (since finding a lactose free substitute was so easy)... BUT, anyone who is adverse to switching away from cows milk MAY want to try heating/simmering it before adding it to their morning tea or coffee to see if they notice an improvement... If nothing else, it has the property of keeping tea/coffee steaming hot... That's all my input on the topic
__________________
KEV

Dx'd July, 2006
Meds: Flagyl, Cipro, Pred, AZA.. to no effect
Low Dose Naltrexone Nov 2007 - May 2014
Remicade June 17th, 2014
08-20-2006, 12:41 PM   #8
Kev
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OK, so I lied (GEEZE, will this guy ever shut up??)... This is to Devildee (or anyone else who is taking calcium supplements, tablets, vitamins, what have you). I was placed on calcium supplements (1500 Mg daily) because of my polycystitus. (they help reduce stones - you'd think it would be just the opposite)... HOWEVER, I've been told by three Nutrition Counsellors from 2 separate hospitals that these are not good for people with IBD.. (WHY??? I dunno) They apparently can inflame the bowel... Now, I've reached the point in my life where I no longer take anyones word on something like this as gospel, but a few nites of surfin da web (I wished I'd bookmarked/kept the results) leads me to believe those nutritionists knew what they were talking about... Long winded story short, I stopped taking them back in January... and like I said previously, I'm having a better year so far..
08-22-2006, 09:01 PM   #9
mikeyarmo
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Thanks for all the info everyone!

I was always taking some calcium supplements, and continue to do so... even now I am not so sure about them . I will continue taking them for now though. I also drink calcium-fortified Orange Juice.

I have decided that dairy will be brought back into my diet, but in a limited role. I think I was just having too much at one time. I will stick to basically yoghurt and cheese for now.
08-23-2006, 02:54 PM   #10
Kev
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Mikeyarmo... One of the complicating factors with my illness was that I was being treated for multiple illnesses, and no one in the medical field was co-ordinating and advocating the whole process other than myself. So literally one hand of the medical field didn't know what the other was doing. In treating the polycystitus, the Nutrionist (without knowing/hearing about the IBD from other than myself) put me on 1500 Mg of calcium supplements, plus had me drinking orange juice AND milk both with added calcium... My IBD kept getting worse while the cyctitus had to eventually be addressed by surgery... So, in spite of the fact that they (the nutrionist on the polycyst. team) were going by accepted practice in treating the disease they were responding to; their bonafide treatment actually worsened my IBD issue... Now the doctors and nutritionists treating me for the IBD say that in hindisght the extra calcium didn't have a positive outcome on the polycyctitis any way (since they eventually had to resort to surgery) but it took my originally mild case of IBD to a state where, 'Ooops, you need to have emergency surgery!!'

I just felt the need to reiterate that something as innocent looking as calcium pills CAN have disasterous consequences. Or at least deleterious ones. Just a word to the wise from a foolish one who has been there, done that. Check into it!!! On a positive note, I understand that some hard forms of cheese can fulfill your dairy needs without the adverse affect of other dairy.. (a good nutritionist should know why it's different, or at least confirm/deny it)... Since I've found other sources that I tolerate and accept, I haven't bothered confirming this or experimenting...
08-23-2006, 08:32 PM   #11
mikeyarmo
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Thanks for the advice there Kev! Hard cheeses supposedly have less lactose (as well as aged ones) so they are usually more tolerated.
08-24-2006, 02:02 PM   #12
Kev
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Just want to clarify something for anyone who reads my contributions. If you are doing well, in remission or maintenance, whatever you prefer to call it... then what you are doing is working for you.. Don't listen to me and monkey around with it. My 2 cents worth is more or less intended for someone experiencing a flare-up, and who might not be aware that some of the common things we are otherwise told is good for us, may not be the case in the midst of a flare.. For a while one of my GI's (when my IBD was mild) advised me to add plenty of fibre to my diet. But all other sources (nutritionists, other GI specialists) tod me to do just the opposite
(one of the pitfalls of this illness - conflicting advice even amongst the "experts") I
really wasn't sure who to listen to... But those latter advisors made a lot of sense,
and then I started listening to my body. Sure enuff, when I'm not flaring, fibre is OK... So, whether it's fibre, calcium supplements or dairy, and you are doing A-OK with it, that's what you should continue to do... If you are flaring, then maybe you
should re-examine some of these very innocent looking practices, and experiment to see if reducing/removing some of these has a beneficial effect on your flare-up.

One of the more frustrating things about IBD is that there is no one source for us to get good, solid, definitive information. And there is almost an endless supply of
Catch 22's (God, so many of you young folk will not be able to relate to that term)
For instance... People with IBD can't readily absorb calcium, and calcium deficiency
can lead to both long & short term problems... But (similar to the case with fibre) some forms of calcium can irritate the digestive system (accerbating a flare-up OR potentially causing one).. Seems like your damned if you do, damned if you don't.

Back when I was a teenager, a family friend developed simple anemia (not the pernicious type).. Local GP (yes, they did have doctors way back then) prescribed iron supplements.. Little red pills.. Problem was the friend didn't tolerate them. It resulted in ulcerated stomach, and she very nearly bled to death. From something as innocent as an iron pill. (shouldn't use the term prescribed, these were NOT a drug in any sense of the word, just simple over the counter vitamins with iron!!)
09-01-2006, 12:56 AM   #13
Skinsfan1229
 
I realize I'm new and havent even posted a self-story yet but admin, you should try some digestive enzymes before giving up dairy...thats what I do , I could handle milk or ice cream when flaring, now, I can eat and drink them all day as long as I take just ONE digestive enzyme.
09-01-2006, 07:29 AM   #14
mikeyarmo
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I have heard of digestive enzymes, but through drinking calcium fortified oragne juice, taking calcium supplements (no problems with those..... yet ) and taking in some diary, I feel that I am fine without them.

For those who are lactose intolerant, or don't take supplements they are a needed component to your diet I would imagine.
09-01-2006, 04:58 PM   #15
Kate
 
there are places in the westurn world that dont have things like milk as processed like here in NZ the milk is all natural well most are you can get some of the processed stuff. but mike the diray could work just remember though that just cause it caused problems then dosnt mean that it will still cause problems in say 6 months
09-02-2006, 11:50 AM   #16
Skinsfan1229
 
I have heard that goats milk is a lot easier to digest to people lactose intolerant, a lot less harsh on the stoamch.
09-02-2006, 05:34 PM   #17
Kev
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Skinsfan. Just an update.. I researched the goats milk thing (simply because I HATE to pop something on any website that I state as rumor but others take as gospel).
Common misconception is that goats milk is lactose free... It isn't, It is a lighter milk than cows milk, and many people do have a better time digesting it. I dunno why! Pure wild ass speculation... they may have issues with gall bladder, or bile ducts or liver, stomach, etc.. that means a lighter milk, with less fat content, digests better. I got the above info from a number of sites for people who are lactose intolerant. Now if someone has other or contradictory info, please feel free to share. My CD research notes that IT (IBD) can and does affect the gall bladder, or the gall bladder ducts (in some cases)... So dairy tolerance, fat tolerance, etc.. depends on where the CD you have has affected your body.
09-05-2006, 06:33 PM   #18
GNC Crohn's Man
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About calcium and IBD... Calcium carbonate is hard to digest in the body... It may also only partialy dissolve in your stomach... Very much so if you are taking things to help control stomach acid production... I make sure I get in around 1200-1600 mg of calcium a day...

How? I take a type of calcium called Calcium Citrate Malate... It is very absorbable and can be taken by people who have low acid contents in their stomach.. Trouble with this is you only get 200 mg of Calcium Citrate Malate, only 50 IU's of FOOD BASED vitamen d (Ergocalciforal), 25 mg of magniusem oxide, and a little potassium...

That is [B]per pill not serving [/B... Serving size is 4 tablets... They want you to take 2 with breakfast and 2 with lunch... I take 2 servings of it a day since I already have osteopina plus I take my fosamax once a week... That means I take 8 of these pills a day... I only take them 2 at a time and only when I eat..

More about calcium
http://www.healthcastle.com/calciumpill.shtml

Another good thing to take is the FOOD BASED vitamen D.... That would be D2 (Ergocalciferol) to go along with it... Since it is the food based Vitamen it shouldn't hurt your body.., Also remember all corticosteriods are proccsed in the liver... That is where your vitamen d is processed too... So you may be getting in 1600 mg of calcium a day but it does you no good unless your body has vitamen D to go along with it.. I take a 400 IU food based vitamen D supplment 6 hours after I take my prednoisone... I do two dosages of prednisone a day (30mg then 30 mg about 12 hours later)...So I take grand total of 800 IU's of food based vitamen D pills... I also get some vitamen D from other sources and from other supplments as well.

Remember there are 2 main sources of Vitamen D out there D2 (Ergocalciferol) and D3 (Calciferol) ...

For more info on Vitamen D click here

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vitamin_D

Ok I hope my babble helps... Remember I'm on valum based medcine so I'm not running on 100% mental capacity here. Granted being drugged up is better than being in a manic/nervous break down state due to the steriods...

Okays cya later,

Daniel

Last edited by GNC Crohn's Man; 09-06-2006 at 01:05 AM.
09-06-2006, 11:27 AM   #19
Skinsfan1229
 
oh wow. I didnt expect so many reponses.

The digestive enzymes I only take when drinking milk or eating ice cream, because I AM lactose intolerant when flaring. I have noticed other benefits of this though, like more formed stools, less bm's also, indegestion and heart burn.

I dont need the supplements to supplement my diet per-se, it just helps in general I feel better.
11-24-2006, 07:35 AM   #20
Mazen
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Try eating natural yoghurt. It has so much less Lactose than milk, and has in addition the good bacteria we need
11-24-2006, 09:38 AM   #21
danika
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Kev said:
Hey guys... Let me throw in my 2 cents... I've found (thanx to my new GI) that it's not so much the dairy, per se, as it is the lactose content... I've switched to using non lactose milk and milk products... and non lactose margarine. I'm on the same meds as before, but this time they are working... You can even get lactose free cheese... (made from vegtable products)... An

I'm going to throw my hand up and agree with you here, I cut milk out altogether because I figured out that it was making me feel very unwell and I was only drinking it with my coffee in the morning, which admittedly was a latte. Then my dietician put me onto lactise free milk and I am back on my home made lattes and loving it. I don't use butter because I can't handle fatty foods but I use nuttelex in cooking which is a vegan product and I can tolerate a small amount of regular cheese, a small amount is sometimes worth the pain.
11-24-2006, 04:50 PM   #22
Cara Fusinato
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Here's my milk concessions . . . I am not drinking milk. I will eat the occasional ice cream sandwich because most of those are fake ice cream anyway, and I am hoping the MAP will be killed by the freezing process. I will make some pasta sauces with milk, but since it is boiled, that too should kill the MAP. I think I read an article about how cold or hot will kill the MAP. However, I do know that I have no trouble with lactose so that is not at all an issue. But, as to drinking milk itself, I have been really really good!
11-26-2006, 02:04 PM   #23
GeoGiGi
 
Try Tofutti Cuties Cara! They are made with soy ice cream so not as heavy as regular ice cream sandwiches and you avoid the dairy. They are "healthy" (or at least healthier!). mmmmmmmmmmm
11-26-2006, 04:34 PM   #24
ruthymg
 
Wow, how much advice? took me ages to read lol

So, heres my contribution. I have tried other types of milk as I too get really bloated with dairy produce. I have tried Soya, so good, goats, oat and lactose free milk all with no joy unfortunately. I now find that the easiest thing for me is just to have dairy in moderation, and it works for me. My problem is that I actually love dairy and so I think that is why I have struggled to find a substitute that I like. Keep us posted on your progress, hope it works for you.

Ruth
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